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Firelok
07-02-2007, 12:05
Map: Desert Online (the new one)

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e150/firelokc/USkasserine.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e150/firelokc/USkasserine2.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e150/firelokc/GerKasserine.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e150/firelokc/GerKasserine2.jpg

USAAF.
A-20C
P-38J
P-40M
SpitfireMkVbLF

Luftwaffe.
Bf-109G-2
Fw-190A-5
He-111H-2
Ju-87D-5

Not envisaged any plane number limits(there's going to be too much taxi-ing havoc on the airfields for that to work IMO.), apart from perhaps the P-38J's ground attack options(like to try it without limits first.).
Didn't want to use P47,P39 these come out on every Med theatre US map was trying to avoid that.
The SpitVbLF is a good candidate for a head to head vs the 109G2(G4 trop.)

The USAAF upgraded to SpitIXc's at some point here but not all at once so decided to gloss over that for gameplay purposes.No Ju88s or Heinkel H6's for two reasons ,one I'd only have to go and limit loads of bombs, two I figure there would be difficultly of supply for the big bombs too. Ju87D5's can use the biggies though, might as well have some advantage.
Three targets for each side, one soft, one medium, one armoured.

The battle of Kasserine pass was one of Rommel's last desert victories and basically the first large scale combat between US Army forces and the veterans of the Afrika Korps, a defeat for the US that they learned a lot from however in terms of organisation and divisional tactics.

Kat
07-02-2007, 12:18
Looking good :D

Firelok
07-02-2007, 21:31
Map tested this evening all technical issues are correct, seemed to devolping some intense dogfighting, so maybe it's Ok.
it's on the server as Kasserine.mis not part of cycle yet.

NS-IceFire
07-02-2007, 22:27
Looks good Firelok. I just checked out this map in the FMB and its a brilliant map by Ian Boys. Well put together, looks good, quite unique.

My only critique on the plane setup would be to have the Mark Vc 2 cannon rather than Vb...our Vb has no air filter for the desert.

Algorex
07-02-2007, 23:36
Problem is that we don't have the LF Vc with vokes filter. Maybe the Vc could be added in addition to the LF Vb. Seafire LF has vokes and the performance, it could be used also.

Anyway against G2 and A5 the LF performance is needed.

Firelok
08-02-2007, 01:53
Yep, I thought the SpitLFVb was the best of limited options, I don't think the SpitVc is capable vs the G2. Plus what we should really have is a G4/trop so err we are missing a filter on the other side too.
*edit*
I just looked at the stats,
Plane kills RED=33: BLUE=28 so things are pretty even in terms of action.

Kat
11-02-2007, 22:57
Tested again tonight :-

http://www.il2hq.com/scstats2/il2sc_stat/index.php?navigation=map/390/index.html

Personally I found the planeset a little limiting althought my dislike of the P38 did bias that a bit. What seemed to be missing from my PoV was something the allied could use to pinpoint group targets effectivly and survive in the environment of 190's and 109's.

The A20 I generally got in and out no problem but struggled to take out tanks ( even half tracks and Panzer II's :/ ) Maybe use the Seafire III's like I did on Monte Cassino to give a ground attack Spitfire V?

NS-IceFire
12-02-2007, 02:12
Although underused, the P-40M is close enough provided you have initiative to attack, match, and destroy a 109G-2 so I think the primary single engine Allied fighter is the P-40 and not the Spitfire. I wouldn't mind a two cannon Spitfire Vc...although you could make up for the lack of advantage by including the 4 cannon as well/instead. Then you could justify it as a strafer as well.

I had a chance to play it this evening and it was great fun. Love the new scenery so I was gawking half the time but we had some good fights. P-38's weren't flown by any good P-38 pilots so I didn't see many of them shoot down a bandit but they were doing some great attack jobs on the targets.

I think this one works quite well!

Kat
12-02-2007, 02:35
Although underused, the P-40M is close enough provided you have initiative to attack, match, and destroy a 109G-2 so I think the primary single engine Allied fighter is the P-40 and not the Spitfire. I wouldn't mind a two cannon Spitfire Vc...although you could make up for the lack of advantage by including the 4 cannon as well/instead. Then you could justify it as a strafer as well.

I did think about suggesting the 4 cannon, but like the other V's assume it doesn't have a bombload, hence suggesting the Seafire III which would give a ground attack capable comparable spitfire.

Firelok
13-02-2007, 15:51
P38 has lots of rockets and bombs for ground attack, P40 has a gig ventral bombload for a fighter. There are some hard targets for reds here dont mistake, The Afrika Korp uses Tiger tanks at Kasserine, however nailing all the other trucks and half tracks along with the tanks should reduced the number of tanks required to be destroyed to a handful.

Kat
18-02-2007, 19:00
Played again tonight and like the last time I played kills are biased in the axis favour, in this case http://www.il2hq.com/scstats2/il2sc_stat/index.php?navigation=map/516/index.html heavily so. Map didn't last an hour, I left early for tea but as the map didn't have a winner not sure why? Admin changed it?

Targets etc. all good fun, although I'd still like a seafire :P - but yeah your right the P38 can take out the ground targets ok if the 20's are struggling. I do still feel the A-A balance isn't right though. Server was about 15v15 more or less.

slm
18-02-2007, 21:13
Played this for the first time today, from the blue side. Are red ground targets too easy? There didn't seem to be much AA and rarely red fighters defending their ground troops. Take off from that desert air field was by far the most dangerous part of missions :)

NS-IceFire
21-02-2007, 00:29
Played again tonight and like the last time I played kills are biased in the axis favour, in this case http://www.il2hq.com/scstats2/il2sc_stat/index.php?navigation=map/516/index.html heavily so. Map didn't last an hour, I left early for tea but as the map didn't have a winner not sure why? Admin changed it?

Targets etc. all good fun, although I'd still like a seafire :P - but yeah your right the P38 can take out the ground targets ok if the 20's are struggling. I do still feel the A-A balance isn't right though. Server was about 15v15 more or less.
Looks like red didn't even bother with the fighters. Just need me and ForkTail flying some P-38's and the Blues will be in for some trouble.

Kat
21-02-2007, 00:36
Looks like red didn't even bother with the fighters. Just need me and ForkTail flying some P-38's and the Blues will be in for some trouble.

Actually there where a lot of Vc's flying, 28 allied fighters got shot down and only 6 bombers. They where just swamped by the 109's and 190's.

Firelok
21-02-2007, 16:39
Well I've looked with interest on this particular trouncing of Reds in detail.
i'm wondering whether SC awards taxiing crashed aeroplanes to the other side.
That aside, the Battle of Kasserine happened so early in 1943 that it's basically a late-1942 planeset.

From what I've discovered trolling the mintynet, primary fighters for USAAF at this stage P40F and the P38F. How many 109G4 tropicals where in frontline use I haven't been able to discover yet or indeed what exact 190A model was being used, the 190A5 is our earliest 'pure-fighter' 190 model available.

SpitVIIIs and SpitIXc getting added this is like adding stuff that wasn't in use yet.(P47,P51 also fall into this category.) at what stage the 109G6 was brought in to Luftwaffe Tunis is also an interesting point.

But I think really this turns on the 109G2, it's a very very good A/C and it should be in where appropriate (and this 1942-43 is it's era.) I think it would be a shame not to have it.
Saying that if this planeset is actually grossly unfair(however correct it may be) making the majority of the 109s available a 109F4 model (limiting the G2) might have to happen.

I inclined to think a number of P38Js (a better model that should actually be here) cruising around over 4000m and BnZ-ing the BnZer's is essential to Red success here.
One plane that I didn't include on the Red side that was probably an oversight on my part was the P39, so I've uploaded a version that includes the P39D2 which at low altitude might cause things to be a little more balanced and was often used for ground attack Fighter-Bomber missions in North Africa too.

Zorin
21-02-2009, 02:06
Please add the Hs-129 ( 5.(Pz.)/Schlachtgeschwader 1 ) here and on Tunis :)