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Firelok
17-03-2011, 13:07
The FoW settings are a fairly new option to IL2 and as yet have not been implemented on any of the servers. I rather think it might be nice to see how it works.

Firstly, No maps Icons difficulty switch totally disables FoW. So disabling the FoW functions doesn't mean re-editing a map, which also helps if FoW maps are used on servers with no intention of having any icons of any sort.

In the configure FoW tab in FMB the missions overall Fog of War settings are enabled.
Advanced Mode is the 'interesting' part. Without it, ALL map icons are displayed to a team that has radar objects undestroyed. Object_76 is this active radar object. It also has to live within a Base home radius to work. This basic Fog of War setting makes for lots of 'clutter' on the player minimap and makes all enemy aircraft show on the map too.

Enabling Advanced mode is the way to go. minimap Radar/Spotting info comes from three sources now.

1. Bases with Radar.

2. Ships.

3. Recon Aircraft.
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1. Bases with Radar.

Default settings are a 'spotting radius' of 50km and a minimum and a maximum height
that things can be spotted at. Enabling a minimum height of 100m seemed a good idea. Firstly this prevents the base from spotting all the ground clutter in it's radius, Secondly this means Base attacks have to come in 'under the radar' or be spotted.
The standard Base 'spotting radius' might be too large for the standard 4gridX4grid dogfight map set up, possibly spotting enemy planes as soon as they leave their own base. Maybe this base radar should be used for 'early warning' of incoming aircraft, rather than relying on hearing the AAA start firing. :D

2. Ships.

Large Ships (Battleships,Cruisers and Carriers) as Fog of War spotters really do employ large detection distances (100km), it's difficult to see how this would in game terms end up any different that just enabling Map Icons without the Fog of War option. In a carrier fleet battle spotting would only be disabled after all enemy carriers were sunk (which is probably going to be a victory condition thus ending the map.) Scenarios aimed at destroying the radar cover of a single capital ship might be a way forwards.
Small Ships (Destroyer Class) have shorter range radar and probably have more use in terms of designing a FoW compliant mission simply because their detection ranges will not 'automatically' give information on all enemy aircraft as soon as the map starts.

3. Recon Aircraft.

These I suspect are the best reason for utilising FoW options on a dogfight map. Their detection ranges are very short, essentially they need to overfly a target or be near enemy aircraft.

With a static target (such as an artillery battery.) map grid locations given in the brief are as effective as ever, this also applies to Static Cameras.
Given that mobile ground targets are NOT going to stay near the cameras nor even in the same grid square, providing locational information to ground attackers becomes much more vague. Describing these locations becomes messy. e.g. " REDS:- must attack convoys travelling thru AT11, AT23,AT13"

Recon Aircraft overflying moving targets then come into their own. Setting up an AI Recon flight ends up being a much more elegant solution. Destroying enemy recon aircraft gives an achievable and appreciable defensive bonus to your side, similarly defending recon aircraft has it's bonus too.
Some thought might be given to 'search and destroy' type missions with specific flyable recon planes
flying without armament to find the targets and 'zero-in' the bombers. A less specific approach might be to allow ground attack/bomber aircraft to act as recon planes. This would give the added benefit showing players when their sides bombers are being stalked by enemy aircraft.
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To sum up Basic FoW and large Base Radar ranges are to be avoided, because it can easily end up as if difficulty options allowing 'show all objects on the minimap' are enabled.

With advanced FoW settings again Base Radar ranges should be lower than default 50km (a matter of experiment I suspect.) minimum height settings should be at least 100m. The idea of Activating Ships radar in a scenario really needs to be 'built-in' to concepts of how the map would work lest it the same as Basic FoW.

Recon Aircraft are probably what is going to add the most use and flavour to employing FoW, even if FoW is disabled I suspect a lot of maps would have the occasional Fiesler Storch or U2-VS overflying the battlefield anyway.

Not every scenario should have any or all of these options, Early War maps should probably never have Base FoW 'Radar'. For example I don't think the VVS would make a great use of it flying from primitive airfields on a rapidly changing front. Arguably the Luftwaffe might do without it in these circumstances too. I don't think the Desert War combatants used much in the way of radar either.

Perhaps Base FoW 'Radar' could be modified to have a much smaller radius of spotting and a lower maximum height, representing blokes with binoculars shouting down a telephone?
Adjusting Base FoW to work within the constraints of our usual '4x4 grid' map sizes is essential, I haven't really got an exact standard figure but I suspect the default range of 50km radius is too large for our purposes.

Setting maps up to Use Recon Aircraft is the way to go in my view, especially with mobile targets.

SMURFY1967
17-03-2011, 18:38
FBDj 1.7 is supposed to be on it`s way mate, check out the greatergreen forum before going barmy with the cycles etc, as in the past some transitions haven`t allowed you to carry over the FBDj info.

Zorin
17-03-2011, 19:12
Good assessment of the FoW situation.

We can have, with some creativity, radar stations where ever we want.

Example of a functional radar station. Can you spot the actual radar? ;)

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb107/ZorinW/th_radarstation.jpg (http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb107/ZorinW/?action=view&current=radarstation.jpg)

Zorin
18-03-2011, 00:53
Need a hint? ;)

Firelok
18-03-2011, 02:02
FBDj 1.7 is supposed to be on it`s way mate, check out the greatergreen forum before going barmy with the cycles etc, as in the past some transitions haven`t allowed you to carry over the FBDj info.

I've looked at FbDj 1.6b, there working away at the 'base capture' zuti thing and have added the ability to recognise target objectives assigned to individual moving objects. 1.7 is probably irons all the base capture stuff I suppose. Greatergreen is offline when I've looked this week. :(

Zorin
18-03-2011, 02:34
Guess I better remove the posts cause obviously I must have hit a wrong note with them. :confused:

Firelok
18-03-2011, 10:37
Guess I better remove the posts cause obviously I must have hit a wrong note with them. :confused:


Is it in the shed?

Zorin
18-03-2011, 16:29
Is it in the shed?

No, its not. I made several tests and you can not get a working solution out of the combination Obj.76 and testrunway as long as you do not make it an active base with at least one plane type allowed to spawn. A possible solution would be to designate a player controled spotter plane type as a very high air start.

For the base above I decided to use a US destroyer hidden in the factory building in the back. Their radar capabilities can be set in the general FoW settings.

Firelok
18-03-2011, 16:42
Ran some tests of a NewUK2 maplist this afternoon with map icons on, FoW enabled. Not all the maps are 'active' in terms of scouting and radar. However I can confirm that I've had the FoW settings running on Uk2 with working spotting aircraft etc.

Zorin
18-03-2011, 23:08
Ran some tests of a NewUK2 maplist this afternoon with map icons on, FoW enabled. Not all the maps are 'active' in terms of scouting and radar. However I can confirm that I've had the FoW settings running on Uk2 with working spotting aircraft etc.

That's great news.